Mishnayos Chullin Perek 8

Color Code: Case: Black; Ruling: Green or Red; Name of Tanna: Gold; Reason: Blue; Condition: Purple; Proof: Grey ; Rule: Fuscia

Chapter 8

Perhaps one of the most distinguishing facets of the "kosher" rules is the prohibition on the mixing of meat and milk. Derived from the thrice repeated words " לֹֽא־תְבַשֵּׁ֥ל גְּדִ֖י בַּחֲלֵ֥ב אִמּֽוֹ " the prohibition, at its core, prohibits the cooking, eating and generally deriving benefit from a mixture of milk and meat.

The eighth chapter of Meseches Chullin lays out many of the details of this prohibition, including:

• Does the prohibition apply to all types of meat?
• Is it limited to kosher animals?
• What secondary precautions must one make to avoid violating the prohibition
• What happens if some milk drips into your meat stew?
• Kashrus in the cheese making process

The final Mishnah, is unrelated to the broader topic, but once earlier Mishnayos differentiated between domestic animals, wild animals and fowl, the Mishnah includes a discussion of certain rules (forbidden fats and blood) that may apply to one and not the other.

Mishnah 8:1

The opening line of our Mishnah lays out the core prohibition against cooking meat and milk together. The question posed, however, is what does the Torah consider "meat" for these purposes.

In the first instance, all agree that fish and locust are not included and, therefore, they may be cooked together with milk, may be placed on the same table as cheese and, if a person vows not to consume meat, fish and locust may still be eaten.

What about fowl? it seems (see Mishnah 4 below) that all agree that fowl is not biblically prohibited from being cooked and eaten together with milk with some even permitting outright consumption. Nevertheless, most Ta'naim understand there to still be a Rabbinic prohibition against consuming in place (cooking and deriving benefit would be permitted). That is the assumption of our Mishnah. Nevertheless, there is a dispute whether one can place fowl and cheese on the same table--with Beis Shammai ruling leniently in this matter.

Finally, the Mishnah clarifies that when it says that is prohibited to place meat and cheese on the same table, that means on the table you are eating from. However, one can place them together on the preparation table, so long as, they are not touching one another.

Mishnah 8:2

Our Mishnah continues with raising additional secondary concerns over mixing meat and cheese. First, while one may wrap them together, caution must be placed on letting them touch in the packaging. Second, the Mishnah teaches that two strangers may eat together at a table, one meat and one cheese, since we are not concerned that they will eat from one another. The implication is that if they are friends or acquaintances, they may not eat at the same table lest they eat off of each other's plates.

Mishnah 8:3

Our Mishnah begins by teaching what happens if milk falls into a boiling pot of meat. Under what circumstances does the meat or the entire pot become prohibited?

The Mishnah then lists three cases in which there is a best practice, but if one fails to follow the practice, he has not violated any biblical prohibition.

The first is milk remaining in cow's udder upon Shechita is not Biblically considered milk, hence, it may technically be cooked together with the udder. Nevertheless, the Mishnah teaches that it is better to puncture the udder and remove the milk before cooking.

Second, the Mishnah teaches that prior to cooking, one must remove the blood found in the heart's cavities. If he failed to do so and consumes the blood, he does not violate a biblical prohibition.

Finally, returning to the topic of fowl and milk, the Mishnah notes that although according to Beis Hillel one should not place fowl and cheese on the same table, (see Albeck who understands that per BH, fowl meat is biblically prohibited) doing so does not violate a biblical prohibition.

Mishnah 8:4

Our Mishnah begins by describing the extent of the prohibition of cooking meat and milk together. By the Torah focusing on prohibiting "cooking a kid in its mother's mil" the Chachomim understood that the prohibition is limited to kosher animals and kosher milk. If either the meat is from a non-kosher animal or the milk derives from a non-kosher source, then the prohibition of milk and meat does not apply. Of course, there remains the general prohibition of consuming non-kosher items.

The Mishnah then describes a dispute between Rabi Akiva and Rabi Yose HaGilili as to whether the prohibition encompasses wild animals and fowl. According to Rabi Akiva, the prohibition includes only domestic animals. Wild animals and fowl are merely rabbinically prohibited. Rabi Yose HaGilili, on the the other hand, rules that wild animals are included in the biblical prohibition. Only fowl is excluded. And according to most, Rabi Yose's position is that cooking fowl and milk is not even rabbinically prohibited and one may cook fowl and milk together in the first instance. Whether Rabi Yose excludes non-kosher animals is the subject of a debate. See Yachin and Albeck ad. loc.

Introduction to 8:5

To create cheese, you must insert an enzyme, rennet, into the milk. This will cause the milk to curd and form into cheese. Rennet typically comes from the lining of a calf's abomasum or from the milk found in its stomach after Shechita. Our Mishnah teaches that if the source of the rennet comes from a non-kosher animal or even a kosher animal that is a Niveila or Treifa, the rennet will render the milk/cheese prohibited. This is regardless of whether the rennet (or a piece of the stomach containing the rennet) imparts taste to the milk. This is because rennet is a "Davar HaMa'amud" something gives the cheese its form and even in miniscule amount will render the cheese non-kosher.

However, when it comes to rennet derived from fully kosher animals, so long as the rennet (or piece of stomach lining) does not impart taste to the cheese, the cheese will be kosher as well. Davar HaMa'amud only applies to something that is inherently non-kosher whereas, meat and milk are only prohibited when mixed together.

Finally, the Mishnah teaches that if a calf suckles from a Treifa, than the milk remaining in its stomach is prohibited. Whereas, if a calf that is a Treifa suckles from a Kosher animal, then the milk remaining in its stomach is kosher.

Introduction to 8:6

The final Mishnah of our Perek is topically unrelated to Basar V'Chalav. Rather it discusses the differences between the prohibitions of consuming blood and forbidden fats. Each of these items has particular stringencies that do not apply to the other. It may be the case that the Mishnah is included since when dicussing blood, it mentions the trio of animals (domestic animals, wild animals and fowl) that we were discussing in earlier Mishnayos.

The opening formula of our Mishnah, is not uncommon and is used frequently to frame an upcoming comparison between two or more items.