Niddah 19aנדה י״ט א
The William Davidson Talmudתלמוד מהדורת ויליאם דוידסון
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19aי״ט א

ואינה יודעת מה הפילה רבי יהודה סבר זיל בתר רוב חתיכות ורוב חתיכות של ארבע מיני דמים הויין ורבנן סברי זיל בתר רוב חתיכות לא אמרינן

and she herself does not know exactly what the appearance of the piece of flesh that she miscarried was, e.g., if it was lost. In this case Rabbi Yehuda holds: Follow the majority of miscarriages of amorphous pieces of flesh, and the majority of pieces of flesh have the appearance of one of the four types of impure blood. And the Rabbis hold: We do not say: Follow the majority of miscarriages of amorphous pieces of flesh. Therefore, Rabbi Yoḥanan’s mention of three cases is meant to exclude this statement of Rabbi Yehuda, who rules that the woman is definitely impure based on a majority.

מתני׳ חמשה דמים טמאים באשה האדום והשחור וכקרן כרכום וכמימי אדמה וכמזוג בש"א אף כמימי תלתן וכמימי בשר צלי וב"ה מטהרים הירוק עקביא בן מהללאל מטמא וחכמים מטהרין

MISHNA: There are five distinct colors of ritually impure blood in a woman: Red, and black, and like the bright color of the crocus [karkom] flower, and like water that inundates red earth, and like diluted wine. Beit Shammai say: Even blood like the water in which a fenugreek plant is soaked, and like the liquid that drips from roast meat, are ritually impure, and Beit Hillel deem blood of those colors ritually pure. With regard to blood that is green, Akavya ben Mahalalel deems it impure and the Rabbis deem it pure.

אמר רבי מאיר אם אינו מטמא משום כתם מטמא משום משקה רבי יוסי אומר לא כך ולא כך

Rabbi Meir said: Even if the green blood does not transmit impurity due to the halakhot of a blood stain or the blood of a menstruating woman, it is blood in that it renders food susceptible to ritual impurity due to its status as one of the seven liquids that render food susceptible to impurity. Rabbi Yosei says: Neither in this sense, as the blood of a menstruating woman according to Akavya ben Mahalalel, nor in that sense, as a liquid that renders food susceptible to impurity according to Rabbi Meir, is green blood considered blood.

איזהו אדום כדם המכה שחור כחרת עמוק מכן טמא דיהה מכן טהור וכקרן כרכום כברור שבו

The mishna asks: What is the red color that is impure? It is as red as the blood that flows from a wound. What is the black color that is impure? It is blood as black as ḥeret. If the black is deeper than that, the blood is ritually impure; if the black is lighter than that, the blood is ritually pure. And what is the color that is like the bright color of the crocus flower that is impure? It is like the brightest part in the flower, which is harvested to produce the orange-colored spice saffron.

וכמימי אדמה מבקעת בית כרם ומיצף מים וכמזוג שני חלקים מים ואחד יין מן היין השרוני

And what is the color that is like water that inundates red earth that is impure? It is specifically earth from the Beit Kerem Valley and specifically when one inundates the earth with enough water until it pools on the surface. And what is the color that is like diluted wine that is impure? It is specifically when the dilution consists of two parts water and one part wine, and specifically when it is from the wine of the Sharon region in Eretz Yisrael.

גמ׳ מנלן דאיכא דם טהור באשה דלמא כל דם דאתי מינה טמא

GEMARA: The fact that the mishna discusses the colors of ritually impure blood in a woman indicates that there is blood that is not impure. The Gemara asks: From where do we derive that there is pure blood in a woman? Perhaps any type of blood that emerges from a woman is impure?

אמר רבי חמא בר יוסף אמר רבי אושעיא אמר קרא (דברים יז, ח) כי יפלא ממך דבר למשפט בין דם לדם בין דם טהור לדם טמא

Rabbi Ḥama bar Yosef says that Rabbi Oshaya says: The verse states with regard to those who come before the court: “If there arise a matter too hard for you in judgment, between blood and blood, between plea and plea, and between leprous mark and leprous mark, even matters of controversy within your gates, then you shall arise, and get up unto the place that the Lord your God shall choose” (Deuteronomy 17:8). When the verse states: “Between blood and blood,” it means between pure blood and impure blood, which demonstrates that there must be types of pure blood that are emitted by a woman.

אלא מעתה בין נגע לנגע הכי נמי בין נגע טמא לנגע טהור וכי תימא ה"נ נגע טהור מי איכא וכי תימא (ויקרא יג, יג) כולו הפך לבן טהור הוא ההוא בוהק מקרי

The Gemara raises a difficulty: If that is so, then does the other expression in the verse: “Between leprous mark and leprous mark,” also mean: Between a pure leprous mark and an impure leprous mark? And if you would say that indeed, this is what it means, is there a type of pure leprous mark? And if you would say that there is in fact a pure leprous mark, according to the verse: “Then the priest shall look; and behold, if the leprosy has covered all his flesh, he shall pronounce pure the one that has the leprous mark; it is all turned white: He is pure” (Leviticus 13:13), that mark is not classified as a leprous mark; rather, it is called a paleness, as a leprous mark is by definition impure.

אלא בין נגעי אדם לנגעי בתים ולנגעי בגדים וכולן טמאין הכא נמי בין דם נדה לדם זיבה וכולן טמאין

Rather, the phrase “between leprous mark and leprous mark” must mean the following: Between the leprous marks that afflict man (see Leviticus 13:1–46) and the leprous marks of houses (see Leviticus 14:33–53) and the leprous marks of garments (see Leviticus 13:47–59), as different halakhot pertain to these categories of leprous marks, and yet they are all ritually impure. Therefore, here too, when the verse states: “Between blood and blood,” it means: Between the blood of a menstruating woman and the blood of a discharge [ziva], and they are all ritually impure. If so, this verse cannot be cited as proof that there is a type of blood emitted by a woman that is pure.

האי מאי בשלמא התם איכא לאפלוגי בנגעי אדם ובפלוגתא דרבי יהושע ורבנן

The Gemara questions this interpretation: This verse serves as the source for the areas of halakha for which a rebellious elder is liable to receive the death penalty for publicly ruling in contradiction to a decision of the Sanhedrin, as it states: “And the man who does presumptuously, in not listening to the priest that stands to minister there before the Lord your God, or to the judge, that man shall die; and you shall exterminate the evil from Israel” (Deuteronomy 17:12). With this in mind, the Gemara asks: What is this explanation? Granted, there, with regard to leprous marks, even if all the leprous marks are impure, one can disagree with the Sanhedrin with regard to the leprous marks that afflict man, and therefore the rebellious elder could potentially disagree with the court with regard to the issue that is the subject of the dispute of Rabbi Yehoshua and the Rabbis.

דתנן אם בהרת קודם לשער לבן טמא ואם שער לבן קודם לבהרת טהור ספק טמא ורבי יהושע אומר כהה ואמר רבה כהה וטהור

As we learned in a mishna (Nega’im 4:11): If the snow-white leprous mark [baheret], which is one sign of leprosy, preceded the white hair, which is another sign, he is ritually impure, as stated in the Torah (see Leviticus 13:3). And if the white hair preceded the baheret he is pure, as this is not considered a sign of impurity. If there is uncertainty as to which came first, he is impure. And Rabbi Yehoshua says: It is dull [keha]. And Rabba says, explaining the statement of Rabbi Yehoshua: In the case of uncertainty, the leprous mark is deemed as though it is of a dull shade, and therefore the person is ritually pure.

בנגעי בתים כי הא פלוגתא דרבי אלעזר ברבי שמעון ורבנן דתנן ר"א בר"ש אומר לעולם אין הבית טמא עד שיראה כשני גריסין על שני אבנים בשני כותלים בקרן זוית ארכו כשני גריסין ורחבו כגריס

Likewise, with regard to the leprous marks of houses one can find a case where the rebellious elder might dispute the ruling of the Sanhedrin, such as that dispute between Rabbi Elazar, son of Rabbi Shimon, and the Rabbis. As we learned in a mishna (Nega’im 12:3): Rabbi Elazar, son of Rabbi Shimon, says: A house is never deemed impure with leprosy unless the leprous mark will be seen to be the size of two split beans, and it is found on two stones on two walls in a corner between two walls. The length of the mark is that of two split beans, and its width is that of one split bean.

מ"ט דר"א בר"ש כתיב (ויקרא יד) קיר וכתיב קירות איזהו קיר שהוא כשני קירות הוי אומר זה קרן זוית

The Gemara explains: What is the reason for the opinion of Rabbi Elazar, son of Rabbi Shimon? The word “wall” is written in the verse, and the word “walls” is written in the same verse: “And he shall see the leprous mark…in the walls of the house with hollow streaks, greenish or reddish, and their appearance is lower than the wall” (Leviticus 14:37). Which is one wall that is like two walls? You must say: This is a corner between two walls.

בנגעי בגדים בפלוגתא דר' יונתן בן אבטולמוס ורבנן דתניא ר' יונתן בן אבטולמוס אומר מנין לפריחת בגדים שהיא טהורה

Similarly, with regard to the leprous marks on garments, it is possible that the rebellious elder disputed the ruling of the Sanhedrin with regard to the issue that is the subject of the dispute between Rabbi Yonatan ben Avtolemos and the Rabbis. As it is taught in a baraita that Rabbi Yonatan ben Avtolemos says: From where is it derived with regard to a case where there is a spread of leprosy in garments that culminates with the garment’s being completely covered with leprous marks, that the garment is pure, just as the halakha is with regard to a leprous mark that fully covers a person?

נאמר {ויקרא י״ג:ל״ט } קרחת וגבחת בבגדים ונאמר קרחת וגבחת באדם

It is derived via a verbal analogy: A bareness within [karaḥat] and a bareness without [gabbaḥat] are stated with regard to leprosy of garments: “And the priest shall look, after that the mark is washed; and, behold, if the mark has not changed its color, and the mark has not spread, it is impure; you shall burn it in the fire; it is a fret, whether the bareness be within or without” (Leviticus 13:55); and a bald head [karaḥat] and a bald forehead [gabbaḥat] are stated with regard to leprosy of a person: “But if there is in the bald head, or the bald forehead, a reddish-white mark, it is leprosy breaking out in his bald head, or his bald forehead” (Leviticus 13:42).

מה להלן פרח בכולו טהור אף כאן נמי פרח בכולו טהור

Just as there, with regard to a person, if the leprosy spread to his entire body he is pure, as the verse states: “Then the priest shall look; and behold, if the leprosy has covered all his flesh, he shall pronounce pure the one who has the leprous mark; it is all turned white: He is pure” (Leviticus 13:13), so too here, with regard to garments, if the leprosy spread to the entire garment it is pure.

אלא הכא אי דם טהור ליכא במאי פליגי

The Gemara concludes: But here, concerning the phrase “between blood and blood,” if there is no type of pure blood at all, with regard to what issue could the rebellious elder disagree with the Sanhedrin? It must be that this verse is alluding to the fact that there is a type of blood of a woman that is pure.

וממאי דהני טהורין והני טמאין אמר רבי אבהו דאמר קרא (מלכים ב ג:כב) ויראו מואב את המים אדומים כדם למימרא דדם אדום הוא אימא אדום ותו לא

§ Once it has been established that there are types of blood that are pure and other types that are impure, the Gemara asks: And from where is it derived that those types of blood that are not listed in the mishna are pure, and these ones that are mentioned in the mishna are impure? Rabbi Abbahu said that the verse states: “And the sun shone upon the water, and the Moabites saw the water some way off as red as blood” (II Kings 3:22), which indicates that blood is red. The Gemara asks: Is this to say that blood is red? If so, one can say that only blood that is red like the blood of a wound is ritually impure, and no more colors of blood are impure.

א"ר אבהו אמר קרא {ויקרא יב, ז} דמיה {ויקרא כ, יח} דמיה הרי כאן ארבעה

Rabbi Abbahu said in response: The verse states, with regard to a menstruating woman: “And she shall be purified from the source of her blood [dameha]” (Leviticus 12:7). The plural form of the word blood, dameha, indicates at least two types of blood. And another verse states: “And if a man shall lie with a woman having her sickness, and shall uncover her nakedness, he has made naked her source, and she has uncovered the source of her blood [dameha]; both of them shall be cut off from among their people” (Leviticus 20:18). The use of the plural form of blood once again indicates another two types, which means that there are four types of blood stated here.

והא אנן חמשה תנן אמר רבי חנינא שחור אדום הוא אלא שלקה

The Gemara asks: But didn’t we learn in the mishna that there are five types of impure blood in a woman, whereas the verses indicate that there are only four? Rabbi Ḥanina says: The black blood mentioned in the mishna is actually red, but its color has faded, which is why it looks black. Therefore, although the mishna lists five kinds of blood, there are only four basic types.

תניא נמי הכי שחור כחרת עמוק מכן טמא דיהה אפי' ככחול טהור ושחור זה לא מתחלתו הוא משחיר אלא כשנעקר הוא משחיר משל לדם מכה לכשנעקר הוא משחיר

This opinion, that black blood is actually red blood, is also taught in a baraita: The black color of blood that is impure is blood as black as ḥeret. If the black is deeper than that, the blood is ritually impure; if the black is lighter than that, even if it is still as dark as blue, the blood is ritually pure. And this black blood does not blacken from its outset, when it is inside the body; rather, it blackens only when it is removed from the body. This is comparable to the blood of a wound, which is initially red, but when it is removed from the body it blackens.

בש"א אף כמימי תלתן ולית להו לב"ש דמיה דמיה הרי כאן ארבעה

§ The mishna states that Beit Shammai say: Even blood like the water in which a fenugreek plant is soaked, and like the liquid that drips from roast meat, are ritually impure. The Gemara asks: But do Beit Shammai not accept the exposition of Rabbi Abbahu that the two mentions of the plural form of blood: Dameha (Leviticus 12:7), and Dameha (Leviticus 20:18), indicate that there are four types of blood here?

אב"א לית להו ואב"א אית להו מי לא א"ר חנינא שחור אדום הוא אלא שלקה ה"נ מלקא הוא דלקי

The Gemara answers: If you wish, say that Beit Shammai do not accept this opinion of Rabbi Abbahu, and they maintain that there are more than four types of blood in a woman. And if you wish, say instead that Beit Shammai do accept Rabbi Abbahu’s exposition, and the apparent contradiction can be resolved as follows: Didn’t Rabbi Ḥanina say with regard to the black blood mentioned in the mishna that it is not an additional type, as it is actually red but its color has faded? So too, with regard to the colors of blood mentioned by Beit Shammai, that of water in which a fenugreek plant is soaked, and that of the liquid that drips from roast meat, one can say that these are not additional types of blood. Rather, they too were initially red but their color faded.

וב"ה מטהרין היינו תנא קמא

§ The mishna states: And Beit Hillel deem blood of those colors, i.e., the color of water in which a fenugreek plant is soaked or of the liquid that drips from roast meat, ritually pure. The Gemara asks: Isn’t this opinion of Beit Hillel identical to the opinion of the first tanna?

איכא בינייהו

The Gemara explains: There is a practical difference between them