Chullin 30bחולין ל׳ ב
The William Davidson Talmudתלמוד מהדורת ויליאם דוידסון
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30bל׳ ב

שמא ידרוסו זה על זה

that perhaps each will cause the other to press the knife.

מתיב רבי אבין שחט את הוושט למטה ואת הקנה למעלה או את הוושט למעלה ואת הקנה למטה שחיטתו כשרה אמאי והא ליכא שחיטה מפורעת

Rabbi Avin raises an objection from a baraita: If one slaughtered, i.e., cut, the gullet below on the neck and the windpipe above on the neck, or cut the gullet above on the neck and the windpipe below on the neck, his slaughter is valid. Based on this, Rabbi Avin asks: Why is the slaughter valid? But in that case there is no clear and obvious slaughter.

הוא מותיב לה והוא מפרק לה בשחיטה העשויה כקולמוס

He raises the objection and he resolves it. This baraita is not referring to cuts on two places on the neck; rather, it is referring to slaughter performed on a diagonal, like the point of a reed [kekulmos] fashioned into a writing utensil. The slaughterer begins cutting from the top of one siman and cuts diagonally downward so that when he reaches the second siman, the knife is lower down.

ההוא תורא דאישחט בשנים ושלשה מקומות על רב יצחק בר שמואל בר מרתא שקל משופרי שופרי א"ל רבי זירא למדתנו רבינו משנתינו בשני סכינין וב' בני אדם

The Gemara relates: There was a certain bull that was slaughtered with cuts in two or three places in the simanim on its neck. Rav Yitzḥak bar Shmuel bar Marta entered the store and took a cut of meat from the highest quality parts of the animal, thereby demonstrating that the slaughter was valid. Rabbi Zeira said to him: Our rabbi, you have taught us through your actions that the mishna: If two people are grasping a knife and slaughtering one animal, even one above and one below, is referring even to a case of two knives and two people who are each cutting the simanim at a different part of the neck with their knives.

אמר רב יהודה אמר רב החליד את הסכין בין סימן לסימן ופסקו פסולה תחת העור כשרה

§ Rav Yehuda says that Rav says: If one concealed the knife in the neck between one siman and the other siman, i.e., he inserted the knife between the windpipe and the gullet, and he severed the gullet first and then removed the knife and cut the windpipe, the slaughter is not valid. If one concealed the knife beneath the hide of the neck and then he cut both simanim, the slaughter is valid.

מאי קמ"ל תנינא או שהחליד את הסכין תחת השני ופסקו רבי ישבב אומר נבלה ר"ע אומר טרפה

The Gemara asks: What is Rav teaching us? We already learn this halakha explicitly in a mishna (32a): Or if one cut one siman and concealed the knife beneath the second siman and severed it, Rabbi Yeshevav says: The animal is an unslaughtered carcass and imparts ritual impurity through contact with it and carrying it. Rabbi Akiva says: The animal is a tereifa, and although eating it is prohibited, it does not transmit ritual impurity. Both agree that the slaughter is not valid in the sense that it does not permit the consumption of the meat of the animal.

אי ממתני' ה"א ה"מ מלמטה למעלה דלא קעביד כדרך שחיטה אבל מלמעלה למטה דקעביד כדרך שחיטה אימא שפיר דמי קמ"ל

The Gemara answers: If this halakha is learned from the mishna alone, I would say that this statement applies only in a case where one conceals the knife beneath the gullet and cuts it from below to above, i.e., from the nape to the front of the neck, because he did not perform the slaughter in the standard manner of slaughter. But if he cut the gullet from above to below, i.e., from the front of the neck to the nape, since he performed the slaughter in the standard manner of slaughter, say that the slaughter is valid. Therefore, Rav teaches us that with regard to any case where one conceals the knife during slaughter, his slaughter is not valid.

תחת העור כשרה בי רב אמרי תחת העור איני יודע

The Gemara proceeds to analyze the second part of that which Rav Yehuda says that Rav says: If one concealed the knife beneath the hide of the neck and then he cut both simanim in the standard manner the slaughter is valid. The school of Rav say that Rav says that in a case where one conceals the knife beneath the hide and cuts the simanim of the animal, I do not know whether the slaughter is valid, or whether it is not valid because he concealed the knife during the slaughter.

איבעיא להו לבי רב דאמרי תחת העור איני יודע תחת מטלית מהו תחת צמר מסובך מהו תיקו

A dilemma was raised before the Sages: According to the opinion of the school of Rav, who say: Beneath the hide, I do not know, if one concealed the knife beneath a cloth that is around the animal’s neck, what is the halakha? If one concealed the knife beneath tangled wool on the neck of a sheep, what is the halakha? The Gemara concludes: These dilemmas shall stand unresolved.

בעי רב פפא החליד במיעוט סימנים מהו תיקו:

Rav Pappa raises a dilemma: If one concealed the knife in cutting the minority of the simanim and cut the majority of the simanim in the standard manner, what is the halakha? The Gemara concludes: The dilemma shall stand unresolved.

מתני׳ השוחט ב' ראשין כאחד שחיטתו כשרה שנים אוחזין בסכין ושוחטים אפילו אחד למעלה ואחד למטה שחיטתו כשרה התיז את הראש בבת אחת פסולה היה שוחט והתיז את הראש בבת אחת אם יש בסכין מלא צואר כשרה

MISHNA: With regard to one who slaughters by cutting two animals’ heads simultaneously, his slaughter is valid. If two people are grasping a knife and slaughtering one animal, even if each is holding a knife and slaughtering one above and one below, with each one slaughtering at a different point in the neck, their slaughter is valid. If one decapitated the animal in one motion and did not slaughter the animal in the standard manner of drawing the knife back and forth, the slaughter is not valid. In a case where one was in the process of slaughtering the animal in the standard manner and he decapitated the animal in one motion, if the length of the knife is equivalent to the breadth of the animal’s entire neck, the slaughter is valid.

היה שוחט והתיז ב' ראשין בבת אחת אם יש בסכין מלא צואר אחד כשרה בד"א בזמן שהוליך ולא הביא או הביא ולא הוליך אבל אם הוליך והביא אפי' כל שהוא אפי' באיזמל כשרה:

If one was in the process of slaughtering two animals simultaneously, and he decapitated two heads in one motion, if the length of the knife is equivalent to the breadth of an entire neck of one of the animals, the slaughter is valid. In what case is this statement, that one must be concerned about the length of the knife, said? It is when one drew the knife back and did not draw it forth, or drew it forth and did not draw it back; but if he drew it back and forth, even if the knife was of any length, even if he slaughtered with a scalpel [be’izemel], the slaughter is valid.

גמ׳ מה"מ אמר שמואל דאמר קרא (ירמיהו ט, ז) חץ שחוט לשונם מרמה דבר

GEMARA: The mishna stated: If one decapitated the animal in one motion, the slaughter is not valid. The Gemara asks: From where is this matter derived? Shmuel said: It is derived from a verse, as the verse states: “Their tongue is a sharpened [shaḥut] arrow, it speaks deceit” (Jeremiah 9:7). Just as an arrow is propelled by drawing back the bowstring, so too, slaughter [sheḥita] must be performed by drawing the knife across the animal’s neck and not by pressing the knife or striking the neck with the knife.

תנא דבי רבי ישמעאל ושחט אין ושחט אלא ומשך וכן הוא אומר (מלכים א י, טז) זהב שחוט ואומר חץ שחוט לשונם מרמה דבר

Likewise, the school of Rabbi Yishmael taught: The verse states: “And he shall slaughter [veshaḥat] the young bull before the Lord” (Leviticus 1:5). The term veshaḥat means nothing other than: And he shall draw the knife across the neck of the animal. And similarly, the verse states: “And King Solomon made two hundred targets of drawn [shaḥut] gold” (I Kings 10:16), meaning gold that is smoothed in the manner of goldsmiths. And the verse states: “Their tongue is a sharpened arrow, it speaks deceit” (Jeremiah 9:7).

מאי ואומר וכי תימא זהב שחוט שנטווה כחוט הוא ת"ש חץ שחוט לשונם

The Gemara asks: What is the purpose of citing the additional verse introduced with the term: And the verse states? The Gemara answers: And if you would say that the term “drawn [shaḥut] gold” means that the gold was spun like soft thread [keḥut], come and hear: “Their tongue is a sharpened [shaḥut] arrow.” In this verse, shaḥut means drawn like the bowstring that propels an arrow, and is not a reference to thread.

רבא הוה בדיק ליה גירא לר' יונה בר תחליפא ושחט בה עופא בהדי דפרח ודלמא עביד חלדה חזינן

The Gemara relates: Rava would examine the arrow for Rabbi Yona bar Taḥlifa to ensure that there were no notches in it. And Rava shot the arrow and slaughtered a bird with it as it was flying. The Gemara challenges: And perhaps when the arrow cut the bird’s neck it performed an inverted slaughter, with the arrow concealed in the neck, and cut the simanim from back to front. The Gemara responds: We see